Inquiry about Ebay Seller of Altered Art

Post by **dragsamou** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 2:57 pm

Hi Eric.
Do you have any examples of the type of work, you do as an Artist?

agzz · Post by **agzz** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 3:18 pm

Eric,

I know of Tereses Alt art but the price is $95, not $20. You may want to check for facts before claiming something. That, not misrepresenting facts and staying on topic in a discussion would be the base of an "adult and constructive relationship" don't you think?

MAGICSALEMAN · Post by **MAGICSALEMAN** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 3:26 pm

Hi Alexis,

There's different types of copyright protections like for example : images/pictures/ texts/theatres etc...
I'm protected as an author so for my texts (books, novels, website texts etc...).

But for an another example :

I have win some few money because one of my story has been read at the radio some times ago. So it is not a real texts physicaly but the distribution in a certain way

Cards is a little the same but the texts are from wotc (so protected by wotc copyrights), the design is from wotc (so protected design (C°)), ideas can be protected too (so here for the cards the mecanisms) and of course the pictures (wotc has the rights usually at 100%) but the intellectual owner propriety think it is the artist but not sure at 100% depend from the conbtract between them.
In any way if it is not the artist, it is wotc.
The Vero program on ebay is present to prevent some "troubleshooting" of those rights.
I sometimes contact ebay and Wotc for those kinds of problems like false Alpha cards, frodulent Boosters Box etc... etc...
You can ask to Wotc or Hasbro in France if you need more infos in case off.
It takes time but for their rights you'll have normaly a quick answer.

Some artist accept that but not all.
I have just write to Terese to know his own opinion.
We'll see in this case.

magic-belgium · Post by **magic-belgium** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 5:33 pm

I don't even know what I should answer to this last post to keep calm and polite...

MAGICSALEMAN · Post by **MAGICSALEMAN** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 8:18 pm

magicbelgium said :

I don't even know what I should answer to this last post to keep calm and polite...

Yes that's the problems.
I try to stay relax and I accept all opinions of everyone but plz relax agzz.

Agzz said :

Eric,

I know of Tereses Alt art but the price is $95, not $20. You may want to check for facts before claiming something. That, not misrepresenting facts and staying on topic in a discussion would be the base of an "adult and constructive relationship" don't you think?

-->
Before to say nonsense agzz :

I have said a poster of Alteration cards or cards and/or you can send cards you can send to her to be altered for free.
I have this poster on my wall, of course I have by it 5 years ago for 20$,now that's possible that's a little bit higher due to the limited quantities.
I don't speak about original Art or Print limited who's of course at a higher price !
Gosh !

Thanks.

Zophar1 · Post by **Zophar1** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 8:59 pm

From the Terese Nielsen Website:

"How much does it cost again?
Alteration Fee $95 per altered card. Get a set of four cards altered and insured shipping is FREE!"

http://www.tnielsen.com/artists/nielsen ... prints.htm

magic-belgium · Post by **magic-belgium** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 9:20 pm

dragsamou wrote:Hi Eric.
Do you have any examples of the type of work, you do as an Artist?

Yes, I'd be interested in seeing Eric's artwork.

agzz · Post by **agzz** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 9:34 pm

Eric,

I'm quite relaxed, thank you.

But what you said was:

I'm can draw and I have the talent to work 5 minutes with paintshop and to sell a altered Force of will from Terese Nielsen for example at 59.99$
If I want to go on hollidays again this year I begin tomorrow
<pic here>
Those altered pictures altered by Terese are sell round 19.99$.

How should I undertand this other then as that you can in paintshop (software i guess) make cards in 5 min, then print & sell them as "altered by TN" for $60. And that real FoWs, really altered by Terese cost $20.

Hope thats not what you mean to say because thats both wrong and irrelevant.

You are mixing things in so I dont even know what anything you say is about anymore, sorry. Where did the poster come into the discussion and how is the poster at all relevant? Or prints, APs, fakes, offset printers, original art...?

I thought this thread was about altered cards... but I might be wrong on that obviously.
Gosh !

EDIT: Zophar1>> thanks.

magic-belgium · Post by **magic-belgium** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 9:35 pm

MAGICSALEMAN wrote:magicbelgium said :

I don't even know what I should answer to this last post to keep calm and polite...

Yes that's the problems.

Well, you act here as an FBI detective or sort of Marvel Heroe that brings justice back on the MTG World.

Why do you feel the need to do this ? What happened to you in the past that leads you do this ? Did you have problems yourself with WOTC ?

agzz · Post by **agzz** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 9:41 pm

magic-belgium wrote:
Well, you act here as an FBI detective or sort of Marvel Heroe that brings justice back on the MTG World.

Funny, I thought more like zealot militia.

But that might be the language barrier working..

edit: found a prefered word i guess.

magic-belgium · Post by **magic-belgium** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 9:51 pm

What makes me sad/mad is that we will end up being punished because of that, when many of us (and others) really like these.

All I hope now is that the drawers won't get into trouble because of a brilliant idea and a tight mind.

PolarBearGod · Post by **PolarBearGod** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 10:55 pm

Your insane if you think it's easy to recreate Magic cards of such quality that can bypass the naked eye and regular standard tests. If it was as easy as you claim, then the T1 market would be ruined. Lots of fakes do come out of asia, but not as easy as you make it out to be. Also, you can't use paintshop, photoshop, or whatever to alter the art on a card and sell it. Example....

This was made in photoshop. Can I print that out at actual Magic Card size? Yes. Can I use it in a tournament? No. Can I sell that to someone? Highly unlikely anyone would be stupid enough to buy a piece of paper glued onto a card that is of no value.

Artists proof sales are based on the popularity of the card and how old it is. Obviously beta proofs are in high demand. Obviously artist proofs of say Jace Beleren, are in high demand. Ass rares, uncommons, and commons have their own market too, but that's why artists can't sell them as easily, because the market for any and all artist proofs is small, whereas artist proofs for old and/or highly playable cards are in higher demand. THAT is why Christopher Rush can't sell an artist proof for a crappy card.

I'm sorry, but if I could have a scribble on a card done by the same artist who draws the card or an alteration done like yawgs, then I'm going with yawgs 24-7. You'll find yourself in a very very very small margin of people who disagree with this.

magic-belgium · Post by **magic-belgium** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 11:03 pm

The more I see these borderless cards the more I love them.

Should I go and see the doctor ?

Great job PolarBearGod !

MAGICSALEMAN · Post by **MAGICSALEMAN** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 11:29 pm

I was talking about the alteration of the poster at 19.99$ on this page :
http://www.daydream-graphics.com/artist ... altposter1
I was perhaps no clear enough, I thought you were talking about the poster. Sorry. $:-\'$

I have ask to Terese directely what does she think about those ""opponent "artists" that use her art to win money.
I'll post her answer when I'll have it.

I'm not a policeman

I'm just an artist who see bad things (win money with the art of some others) and I just want to react and to explain a little my thoughts and the copyrights law and problems that coulb be result in thoses kinds of cases.
It's easy to do them, a false rolex on each corners of every street, false champagne, false Dvd, everything can be now in this world easily copy.
It's just a question of artist protection and laws in applications even if for example this cryptic is beautiful.
It is the open door tomorrow for perhaps a complete set Morningtide altered or other things...

But I respect your opinions that's the choice of everyone.
That was just a way for me to discover you some problems who could result for the artists and wotc (somewhere).
Go to sleep Guys

Ps magic belgium :

http://www.smfcorp.net/funcards/smffcmonline

If you like those types of design for your OWN use

Software Prohibited by wotc.
Cards make in 30 sec but no borderless.

yawg07 · Post by **yawg07** » Wed Dec 05, 2007 1:47 am

What the HELL does Photoshop/graphics software have to do with ANY of this?
I can't understand where you try to go with that! These cards are NOT changed into other cards/misrepresented/forged/faked.
They are simply PHYSICALLY drawn on. Drawn on in a way to bring a special allure to your deck, something to wow people.

If anything, with T.Nielsen's page, you just argued against yourself. Basically it is stating that it is okay to alter cards.
And since I don't know any of the artists, I would not ever know or really have to be worried about "offending" them.

Wow I honestly feel enraged! I am in disbelief that someone can argue a topic but COMPLETELY ignore anyone else.
WHO IS TALKING ABOUT FAKING CARDS FOR CRYING OUT FUCKING LOUD!

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