Black Lotus for Christmas!

mystical_tutor · Post by **mystical_tutor** » Thu Dec 24, 2009 8:22 pm

I sold a fellow an unopened Alpha Starter and this is what he sent me:

http://www.mediafire.com/?zaomgnjeibw

Now his question--that he would like imput on.

Should he open it to send it to PSA?

Or leave it like it is (never knowing what is under it).

What would you do?

Super_Morphling · Post by **Super_Morphling** » Thu Dec 24, 2009 8:36 pm

hahaha Incredible! The first!

I want it :(

Hayden · Post by **Hayden** » Thu Dec 24, 2009 9:32 pm

I have deleted this post as it may have been interpreted as an accusation against Gary (the seller) when it was not in any way.

l0qii · Post by **l0qii** » Thu Dec 24, 2009 11:19 pm

Going with the assumption it is real...

I would not open it. I think it's more unique as a collectable sealed.

dry cereal · Post by **dry cereal** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 12:40 am

but if he opens it he wont know if it's harry potter backed. I suspect malarkey

mystical_tutor · Post by **mystical_tutor** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 1:43 am

Hayden wrote:... I'm thinkin fake! Probably wants someone to offer him huge bucks for it as is LOL

I know the Beta starters had the rares deeper in the pack and uncommons on the bottom. Not sure if Alpha were the same but I would suspect they used the same collation practices/equipment for both sets. And I am pretty sure the shrink wrap seam is along the sides of the deck instead of the faces (but I could be wrong on that and I'm not about to crack my sealed Beta starter to find out).

If he sells it sealed as is he can always claim the fake was in there when he bought it. You should ask him what he would want for it and see if he is already thinking of flipping it before getting it graded - that would be a huge giveaway that he is evil!

Then again if he checks these boards he will be wise to this trap... but at least there is a reduced chance of anyone here getting hosed.

Merry X-Mas all

Sorry my post wasn't more clear. This is a deck I sold him. A deck that Peter took out of a Carta Mundi display box and has been in a vault ever sence. I hope you don't think I would fake something like this as I would be deeply wounded. Your inditement of the owner as evil--were he even interested in selling it--is a very depressing judgment call based completly on negative speculation.

I do have a couple Alpha starters that I have taken out of the box and left in the shrink wrap--for demonstration pourposes--and the shrink wrap is the same. Note scan:

http://www.mediafire.com/?yqmbgrqn3zj

All the Alpha's I have opened have had the two rares on the top just as this one (another reason PSA 10 Alphas are more rare).

I strongly doubt that this item is for sale.

Gary

Hayden · Post by **Hayden** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 2:16 am

No Gary, I would never have thought that you set this up... sorry you thought I may have been implying that.

I was just saying that your buyer could have opened up the sealed starter deck you sold him and then place a fake BL in the front and re-shrink wrap it (that would be very easy to do).

It is too bad he did not make a video of himself opening up the original sealed starter box and pulling the sealed deck out to reveal this beauty! I would probably be less sceptical about it then - too many bad eggs out there.

At this point since it would be hard to prove authenticity, I'd say he should send it in for grading to really ensure it would hold it's proper value... especially if it got a grade of 10! Now that would be something!

PS: Thanks for confirming the shrink wrap orientation... good to know

andytalaga · Post by **andytalaga** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 3:59 am

I know a guy who used to play at my store that purchased a sealed Alpha starter and the first card was a Lotus so it is highly likely that in Alpha starters it was RRCCCC...UUUU... distribution.

pickle.69 · Post by **pickle.69** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 9:46 am

Like with signed, allthough i like it,

One day all will be opend( or signed)

KEEP IT CLOSED!!!!

mystical_tutor · Post by **mystical_tutor** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 4:39 pm

Hayden wrote:No Gary, I would never have thought that you set this up... sorry you thought I may have been implying that.

Thank you, as a retired Army Officer, having my integrity questioned is very painful.

Hayden wrote:I was just saying that your buyer could have opened up the sealed starter deck you sold him and then place a fake BL in the front and re-shrink wrap it (that would be very easy to do).

I seriously doubt that the CM shrink wrapping of Alpha decks (as opposed to later packaging) could be duplicated without an industrial wrapper. The reasons I say this I will keep to myself as it has proven valuable to me in the past.

Gary

mystical_tutor · Post by **mystical_tutor** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 4:51 pm

andytalaga wrote:I know a guy who used to play at my store that purchased a sealed Alpha starter and the first card was a Lotus so it is highly likely that in Alpha starters it was RRCCCC...UUUU... distribution.

That is not quite correct. It is RRUUUU....... Rule Book CCCC.....

If I can manage my scanner I will scan the deck from the edge for those interested.

Gary

random · Post by **random** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 8:06 pm

"What would you do?"

Depends on why the guy bought it in the 1st place. I'd open it and see what else is there. The temptation to re-sell might be too great then? I'd like to get one of those decks Gary

tap4black · Post by **tap4black** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 11:57 pm

What would I do, more like what I DID...........

I've also bought decks from Gary over the years. Back about 5-6 years ago when I was first starting my PSA set, one was opened with a Lotus as the facing card. I left it sealed for awhile but the temptation was too great and I busted it open. The Lotus ended up grading out as a PSA 9 as did the MOX EMERALD that was nestled underneath the top rare

If I had it to do over again, I'd certainly have left the deck wrapped as it is worth far more as a collectible that what I pulled in cards even with the 2 power 9's. Sad thing is I bought another Lotus at Gencon literally a couple months later than ended up grading PSA 10. If I could have held on just a little longer........

Hayden · Post by **Hayden** » Sat Dec 26, 2009 4:39 am

tap4black wrote: Lastly for Hayden, please try to keep your accusations to yourself when you have zero idea of who the decks owner is and who the seller was. You come off as a complete A** by attacking Gary's integrity and your lack of knowledge about Alpha deck packaging and how near impossible it would be to duplicate the sealing process used.

Tap I am sorry you took the wrong meaning of what I was saying. I have deleted my original post out of respect for Gary as I was not attacking him in any way shape or form - I was just trying to protect other forum members from unscrupulous buyers out there. I an an engineer who has seen far too many shrink-wrappers to know that it is actually very very easy to duplicate the sealing process with regular clear wrap. So my comments regarding the wrap issue were totally sound. The original image posted by the buyer (not Gary) could have been easy to fake - just a fact - not an accusation. Please read all relevant posts before you wrongfully call someone an A**.

mystical_tutor · Post by **mystical_tutor** » Sat Dec 26, 2009 4:49 pm

Hayden:
Thank you for clarifying your comment and reassuring me of your intent. I am partly at fault for not making my original post more clear and specific. Your apology is not only accepted but appreciated.

Tap4black:
Thank you for your spirited defense and background on this matter.

All of us:
Let’s take all that has been said in its best light and give each writer the benefit of a doubt--in spirit with the dignity of our board, our chosen hobby and the season of the year.

I consider "collectors" (as opposed to speculators or accumulators) a breed a cut above the average. People that are willing to work at something rather than vegetate in front of a TV. It behooves us, likewise, to interact with each other at a cut above.

Where did I get this soap box? When I stopped to think that we are entering a new year of our lives with a chance to make them better. Looking at my own shortcomings (specially when I try to communicate with a keyboard) I realize I have no room to pontificate.

This thread was started in order to share a rare experience that we could each enjoy. I would like to carry it on in that spirit.

The very best to each of you in this new year and may you all pull a BL, in your lives, in your relationships, in your businesses and in you hobbies.

Gary

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Black Lotus for Christmas!

Would you open this?

Black Lotus for Christmas!

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